A Life of Good Food | Maggie Beer on Ageing With Purpose and Passion | Club Sandwich
Maggie Beer, cook, author and founder of the Maggie Beer Foundation, joins Sarah Macdonald to talk about food, ageing and why what's on the plate in an aged care home matters more than most families realise.
Ageing parents? You've got them. We've got you.
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In this episode:
The Conversation: Maggie shares why aged care food is a wellbeing issue, not just a nutrition one, the physiology behind why older palates need more salt, sugar and flavour, and why leadership is the biggest predictor of whether a home's kitchen actually works for its residents.
This Week's Hack: Before you choose an aged care home for a parent, go and eat a meal there yourself, without telling them you're coming.
Send This To: Anyone touring aged care homes right now, or anyone who keeps dropping meals off to mum instead of cooking with her.
Topics covered in this episode:
- Why aged care food is a wellbeing issue, not just a nutrition one
- The one-line test for touring an aged care home
- How taste and smell change as we age, and what that means for cooking
- Cooking with your parent, not just for them
- Ageism, and the 80% of healthy ageing that's within our own control
- Maggie's own philosophy on staying creative, positive and purposeful with age
Featured in this episode:
Sarah Macdonald — Veteran broadcaster and host.
Maggie Beer AO — Cook, author, co-host of The Cook and the Chef, and founder of the Maggie Beer Foundation, which trains aged care kitchens nationally.
Meet the regular Clubbers:
Melissa Reader — CEO of Vera and expert on Australia's ageing crisis.
Jo Lamble — Clinical psychologist specialising in guilt and family dynamics.
Dr Ginni Mansberg — GP and women's health advocate who tells it straight.
Dr Stephanie Ward — Geriatrician helping you understand when "old" becomes a crisis.
Kerry Milligan — Gogglebox star bringing humour and honesty to the sandwich generation.
This episode was supported by Australian Unity, home health and care services — australianunity.com.au/clubsandwich.
Vera is your candid companion as you care for an ageing parent. Have a look at https://vera.guide.
FACES (Families for Aged Care Equity and Support) is a family-led campaign asking for one honest count of the number of people waiting for their aged care funding and the people who die while they're waiting. Add your name at vera.guide/faces.
Put The Kettle On — Vera's free conversation guide: the five questions worth asking your ageing mum or dad, at putthekettleon.com.au
Credits:
Sarah Macdonald – Host + Executive Producer
Melissa Reader – Commissioning Editor, Executive Producer + Clubber
Justin McArthur – Executive Producer + Editor for P. Zinner Pods (https://pzinner.com.au)
Thanks and kudos to Sean Wayland for our theme music Club Sandwich — hear more at https://seanwayland.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Transcript
This podcast was recorded on Kaurna Land. We recognise elders past and present. Always was, always will be Aboriginal land. Club Sandwich is brought to you by Australian Unity Home Health and Care, helping Australian families keep their parents well, independent and at home for longer. Visit australianunity.com auclubsandwich. Welcome to Club Sandwich. Now this is a podcast for you if you might be cooking really well for a parent right now, but not always thinking about how well you are cooking and nourishing yourself. My name is Sarah McDonald. My mum is 93, she likes very spicy food. My mother in law is 95. Blander the better. Today we're talking about food, we're talking about aging and we are talking about nourishment that food is. And who can we do that with but Maggie Beer. She is the heart of our kitchens with her cookbooks, her television shows and her fantastic campaign to improve the food that is in our aged care system with the Maggie Beer Foundation. Maggie, welcome to Club Sandwich.
Oh, thank you, Sarah. Delighted to sit with you.
Good to have you on the podcast, G. Food's changed a lot since you were cooking in Scotland for people and.
You mean the one that I got sacked after six weeks cooking in a sailing school and using the whole of their, their pantry for the year so
they had to starve for the rest of it. You know, you think about how our kitchens are stocked and what we're eating now and how well we're nourishing ourselves and it because I grew up on, my mum could cook.
Yes.
But we were just boring. So it was a lot of mashed potatoes and peas and chops. We don't eat like that at all anymore.
Well, no, we don't. Well, the adventurous Australians don't. There are, there are conservatives as well. But I grew up with every bit of the animal offal was our favorite thing. So in when I consider the times that I grew up, I'm 81 now, so it was pretty boring in the shops, but not in our household.
Have your taste buds changed much over the years?
Well, no. No. I know in general as you age, your taste buds do, if you like, diminish for most people, but because I use them so much in my work, mine is still okay.
It's fine tuned.
Yes, it is fine tuned and just like every part of you, if you use it and refine it and there is no reason for it to go downhill.
So the use it or lose it thing that applies to our brains also applies to our senses.
Absolutely.
And our tastes.
Yes.
So I wonder what Happens then why they decline? Is it because people start eating blander and easier and.
Well, they're interesting physiological things and in science they will tell you that for an older, you need to have significant more salt and sugar, particularly for the normal palate of an aged person to detect. And on the other side of it, you're more likely to detect bitter by five times. So there is real, you know, there is science behind it, which is why it's really important to understand where someone is in, in their taste profile, if you like, which really does connect to their age for the most part.
Right.
Except exceptions.
Yes. And then we've also got individual differences in that.
Oh yes. Well, your mum liking spice food all her life, I presume not just come to it. Oh yes, but that's wonderful. And I really think, you know, there are a lot of people there that think older people like really bland food.
Like your mother in law.
Mother in law. But I just, I think there's so much perception about that is what they want. Whereas if you, most people given something that's so full of flavour, no matter what age, they respond to it and
say, yes, but what have you learned then in terms of you when you said that while you age the taste buds change and so the food needs to be different generally. What is the, what have you learned about that, about how that works? Cause it's connected to smell too, which can also change.
Yes, well, the sense of smell is the most dominant, you know. And whilst we're not going to talk aged care, you know, entirely in aged care cooking, often the sense of smell is so different from where it's being cooked and where it's finally eaten. It can be cooked in the basement and then brought to the dining room and there's no wafting of aromas of real food. And that is a huge, that is a huge loss. But what I've learned is the need to build flavor in whatever you're cooking and in building flavor, you don't just put all your ingredients in and turn the dial. It is, it's a building up and the seasoning must be right and it must be right. If it's a young person cooking and it's person eating, then they have to understand what they need to do in terms of seasoning. But building flavour is a different issue. That is really knowing how to cook to get the most out of your ingredients.
And you're very passionate about people working in aged care homes learning how to cook properly.
That's right. And being given the skill and the ideas and the inspiration but, but the support because they have the hardest job. If you could imagine cooking for 120 people every day and it's morning, breakfast, lunch, dinner, morning and afternoon tea and supper. Now obviously that's two shifts, but even so it can be relentless unless you have that knowledge that will make a difference. So you are proud of what you're doing and that pride because you're pleasing your residents and they are loving what they're eating. So there is that immediate respect and
feedback and being part of it. I mean, where it's cooked. I mean, of course, I mean I hadn't thought about people, their meals being cooked somewhere else and brought up. Yes, you're losing all of that's nearly
always because they're big. Often if there are 120 people in a home, which is very common, often in the basement. And so, you know, how do we put those aromas into the kitchen? Because if they're in a bain Marie, that's not going to be what they need.
And so what are some of the issues that when you said if it's a young person, how can they be trained to understand the older person's Easily
what we find with the foundation, our trainer, mentor programs, when you have leadership that is really engaged and everyone is engaged in the process of understanding that the more knowledge and advice, support, skill, all of those words given to a receptive audience, which is the kitchen team, they want to do well, but you need to give them the skills to be able to do well. It's such a positive, it's such a positive output when that happens. If you have beautiful food in an aged care home, everyone has positive energy because they're proud and residents are happy, the staff are happy. It's a laid down misere.
Yeah. It's probably the best thing you can do, isn't it? Because the kitchen is the heart of a home and the place where the residents eat is the heart of an aged care home.
I truly believe that a cook or a chef making real food with all of their knowledge and passion can do more for the resident than anywhere else, anyone else. So I see it as a well being model I would like to see rather than a health model. I mean you have to have both. But the well being is so important to give a good life to the end of life.
When they always, everyone always says health and wellbeing, they totally go together, don't they? Absolutely.
Equal parts, but yes, equal parts.
What have you seen change in the work you've been doing because you've Been doing this for some time now. It's been a great passion. Yes. More than a decade. So how, you know, I know there's been some setbacks probably along the way too, hasn't there?
Well, of course there are always setbacks. But since 2022 we've had these tranche of programs, online learning modules. I've made 17 of them where real gaps in training for those people in aged care, particularly the kitchens. We've done what, 137 homes where we've worked with one year with each home. But hands on at the, at the stovetop where you really can cook with people and understand their issues and their brick walls. So what I've seen is a combination of leaders who embrace this and really want this to happen because they believe in the power of food to well being. And I've then seen others that just don't have that belief but go through programs, but they're not sustainable unless everyone is behind them. You need to believe it and then you can make it happen. But I've seen leadership be of two strands, the great and the okay.
And we need it to be great.
We need it to be great. And everything comes from leadership, don't you think?
Yeah, absolutely. Bad leadership, everything falls apart. It ruins the culture underneath, the relationships within it. And I think that, you know, the elderly in aged care homes can sense when it's all falling apart at the top. You know, you can just sense that everything's not cohesive and connected and everybody's not on the same page. It's like any institution really, any workplace. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure they can. But I think what we try and do on this podcast, we try and give people practical advice. So perhaps when you're going and you're looking with a parent at a facility, they're perhaps moving into an aged care home. I guess, you know, number one, have a meal there.
Exactly. You said it right. And that's it. And I encourage.
And they don't let you don't go out.
Exactly.
Don't go in.
It is so important. If you were putting someone you loved into an aged care home, you want to know that the care is there and the love of food is there and there's no other way than sitting down and eating with the residents. And also don't tell them in advance. Just drop in, drop in, drop in at lunchtime the first time and go into the dining room and smell it. And if they make space for you, if they can't make space for you on that day and you Ask to come the next day, that's fine. But don't give them advance notice that people can put on a show, spruce it up. Yes.
Yeah.
Not that many would do that.
No, of course they wouldn't. Absolutely. Totally. They would never do that. No. It's a really good piece of advice because it is a. It's a massive thing that I think a lot of people forget about too.
But it's not just that, but it starts with that. Yeah. The other thing that's really important is when the home itself encourages the residents to do as much for themselves as they can or want to. And I know when I did the ABC Big Mission and spent a week, a month for six months there, and I saw the change in the residents when they were encouraged, allowed and encouraged to iron the serviettes, to lay the tables, to pick the flowers, to wipe the cutlery. Because the interesting thing it was they would doing it to have a focus in their day. But it also gave them more friendships because in aged care homes, often they always sit with the same people. And so it widened their friendships within the home, so it widened their conversation with each other. The lifestyle part of the home is also encouraging gardening and the doing.
The doing. The purpose.
The doing and purpose.
Yes. The peeling of the potatoes. We went today. But, you know, I heard at a place I visited once about this, and they said because the residents won't wear gloves, so they want to come and knead dough and they want to make biscuits, but we're not allowed to eat the biscuits. They can eat their biscuits, but we have to sell the rest as dog biscuits because they haven't obeyed the occupational health and safety concerns. So we can get wrapped up in the bureau. I was like, that's.
You can get so wrapped up in
that, going in the oven, they're cooked well.
You know, one of the things that I love to encourage home is to have an ordinary domestic oven in the dining room, because there's always a little part for having morning and afternoon teas and serving things out. So it's very easy to put one in and then have the ability for. The residents can come in at a time, mix scones together and put them in the oven and have that smell, that aroma just coming through and sharing it for afternoon tea. You know, don't try and do it to sell to people.
No, that's true.
See for themselves.
And if you make too many, you'll eat them eventually. Yeah, it's back to that smell again, which does connect. And it's interesting with things Such as dementia or cognitive decline. Smell is our older sense.
Yes.
Connects to the primitive part of the brain and it activates memory and connection.
And it's so important to keep. It's so tangible. It's so important that that should be smells of with food particularly that smells evokes memories and good memories and memories of childhood and just, just good memories. And they, they are underdeveloped when the kitchen is, is far away from the dining room.
I mean for people who. I think it's a really great advice you give there for people who are cooking for their parents in the home if their parents are still living independently. This is an interesting one because I think a lot of people start thinking, I think mum's just having tea and toast a lot. And we start worrying about nutrition.
Yeah.
And so I guess one thing to do is. And we used to cook in batches and take stuff over but now I'm thinking I should have cooked with mum more. Why didn't I learn all her amazing recipes?
This is an amazing segue for me. Because the second iteration, well, not iteration because we'll always stay with food in aged care. We're committed to that long term and we can see the life changing ways that are happening when the recipe is right. From leadership down. But it's those. We've just done a home plate project and the Wicking trust gave us some money and we've done a year's research on how are people who are living alone, particularly eating in the home. And that has been through surveys and then one to one meetings in shopping centers and actually talking to everyone about how their world is and what are their limitations and have they lost the motivation and are they thinking of nutrition? What we found more than anything else was the fact that most are doing okay until they don't. Now that sounds a bit vacuous but something happens in life. Grief, loneliness, money troubles, all sorts of things.
Hospitalization.
And then they go right downhill. But the thing that was, it's very easy to get food delivered to the home these days. And you have choice, you know, you have choices that are economically driven, but they are choices. But what is more important than anything else is the social aspect. And the social aspect and the loneliness leads to this downhill slide. And the best thing of all is not taking food to your mum, but cooking with her. Not just to learn her recipes, but that she. The research says very clearly that an older person will eat more when they're eating with others. It's very clear.
Of course.
And then there's the whole of the family, the intergenerational issues that we know are necessary. But you see this research and it's so clear of how they're energized and given that will to do better with their food every day. There's so much, there's so much we have to do as a community, as a society.
It's so true. And when people are really busy, they just don't think about, you know, kind of that connection. But you're so right because I think about times we all cooked together and how fun it was. And then you get that intergenerational influencing of each other as well and suggesting things and yeah, that's togetherness.
That's the really beautiful thing because that's a real win win connection that happens. And also the nutrition that's suitable for an older person is quite different from the nutrition that's suitable for us between 20 and 50 and 60. It really, the amount of protein and, and dairy is really quite, quite different. And this is not known in the community, not known well enough in the community. And people who have lost their will to look after themselves because they think a piece of toast and a cup of tea is okay for breakfast or a cup of dinner, soup, a steam dumpling from the freezer. Every meal should be a celebration of eating something that's really tasty, but it's full of goodness and flavor in equal parts to give people the energy for their bodies to be mobile and involved. But it's emotionally. And not every older Australian and perhaps more women always think they're worth it for themselves. I was just about to say that. And that is what we must do something about.
Yes, but this often declines too, doesn't it? I mean, we talk about so many decline in aging and all my parents declined or this has happened. But what's often declining is their belief that they are of purpose, that they are important, that they matter. And there's that sort of internalized, you know, sort of anti ageist assumptions.
Yes, there's a huge ageism in our society, but it can be an internal one too for our older population. And there was just a few months ago in Oxford, Oxford University in the uk, they had a longevity project. And out of the longevity project, the findings were that 80% of our ability to be well in a as we age is within our own reach. And it's not genetics, it's not genetic.
Some is, but.
Well, yes, yes, 80% is within us to do something about always having a good food life and a good exercise and cognitive Ability and all of those things, of course we've got to work at it. But the fact that 80% is all within us is just not being accepted. Now, there are people that will say there are economic reasons. Not everyone has the choice. But it's something that we just can't see aging as a downhill slide. Aging can be an amazing time where you have time, you have freedom, you have time to do things that you never had time to do before. But you have to believe that and you have to look after yourself well to be able to have that be your life.
And if you don't think you deserve it or you are feeling, they say that the worse you feel about aging, the worse it will be. It becomes this snowball.
Exactly.
Doesn't it?
Exactly.
And there's that sort of. Then that becomes. Makes you feel older, which makes you feel worse, which makes you harder on yourself. Maggie Beer said something today that I just keep coming back to. She would like to see aged care run on a wellbeing model, not just a health one. Because good food gives people a good life right to the end of it. It's a small word, wellbeing, and it covers an enormous amount. What's on the plate, what the house smells like. Who do you sit down with? Australian Unity's Home Health and Care works on the same principle, supporting your mum and dad to stay well and living at home where the kitchen is still theirs. Visit australianunity.com. If you are waiting on a home care package, you know how hard that waiting is. 10 months on average and nothing funded in the meantime. It's hard on everyone, on them and on you. Now Vera is building something that lets eligible families start care straight away and it's looking for a small number of families to build this with. If your parent owns their own home, email helloira Guide and you can be part of it. So, I mean, you've always been a person. I think that, you know, how old were you when you senior Australian of the Year? You were only 60.
I was 65. I had no idea. I was young. I had no idea I was clapping. Classified as the senior.
Oh, no, it's too funny. You didn't see yourself as senior even then. So think about since then. Where have you've been so creative since then? Like, what happens to creativity? Do you think as you get older, because you mentioned you have more time and space, so where does the creativity and the intelligence go when you give yourself more of that, that people just don't understand?
Well, there's no barriers there's no barriers, but you need to be interested in life. You need to have things that you're passionate about. That is really important right into old age, to the end of our life. If we have things we're passionate about. It fires creativity, and creativity comes in so many different forms, as we well know. But it really does fire the imagination to know that you. You can follow something that you really love to do, even if you're not as like, my garden is something that I love so much, but I had a bad accident two years ago, and I'm 95% recovered from it. But I will still be out there for hours. But the only limitation I see in myself is after 3 hours I can't move and I've got to wait for the next day. But it doesn't stop me. It fires me up to do more in the garden because I have. I take time to recover. To recover.
So you can go back out?
So I can go back out there? Yeah. Yeah.
How much do you think that attitude has helped you recover from that bad accident?
Oh, oh, yes. I've. I was positive from day one. Even though, you know, it was so bad. That was. It was really bad. But I. I remember saying to the surgeons every day, I know I'll get better. I always knew I would get better.
And what were they saying back to you?
Oh, well, they just loved. They loved that I wanted to know everything and I was still positive because a positive mind can do a lot. And it fired me. And they, they didn't sugarcoat, but it didn't stop me. And so I had a great rapport, right.
And they were like, okay, yeah, she's gonna heal herself, this one, to some extent, with our medical advice, of course, and expertise. How do you keep that positive mindset? Have you ever had times where you've found it hard to keep that?
Oh, we've had some awful things in life, but even. And you know, there are things that you have to go through and come out of, so it doesn't mean that you don't go down at times, but that positive. I was born with it. I really feel I was born with it and I inherited it from my mother. And a joy in life, but that joy comes from family. It comes from music. Music is so part of my life. And cooking and gardening and reading and all of the things. Art, all of those things I just love. But it doesn't. I was going to say music pulls me out of grief. Grief.
Okay. What do you put on? What kind of music pulls you out?
Classical Classical?
Yes.
I mean, I love jazz, jazz. Classic, opera's my great love, but it's actually. It's actually classical music. And every. Every violin, viola and cello that ever lived seems to connect to my heartstrings and pull me up. Yeah.
And for other people, it might be something else. It's so. Yeah. To know yourself and to know what pulls you out, because grief needs to be honoured. No one's gonna be happy and positive all the time. But, yes, you're one of those people. It's your baseline.
It's my baseline.
So you will come back to it. And I think that's part of the power you've always had, is that passion as well.
You've kept that passion, I've kept that passion. And you know what I love to do is I love to share the difference that food can make to your lives and how you can make it easy. And part of that is because food's been so important to me and I've never been trained, so I'm a chaotic cook. Right. I'm true chaos. I love that.
That's. That's good. I mean, you know, perfectly organized cooks are impossible to learn from.
And so it's. It's one of the joys I have of sharing. I love to share the things that I can know, can make a difference.
People. It makes sense. And you must have heard stories over the year of how people have connected to your joy of food and nutrition and cooking and how it's had an impact on them.
Yeah, well, the cook and the chef, those four years, Gorge Cooking with Simon Fr. And we did 150 episodes, and I traveled quite a bit with the foundation and with life and the number of people that come up to me that grew up with the cook and the chef or watched it with their grandmother when the grandmother didn't speak English. And, you know, the stories that I'm told, and it just. Well, Simon and I both love to hear those stories.
Isn't that great? Because you're connected to people.
Yes.
Through that.
Yes.
And through. It was a great, fun show. I hope it's probably on somewhere.
It is still.
Is it still?
It's never been off.
You talked about purpose, you've talked about passion. They're obviously great keys in your life and creativity in terms of positive aging.
Physicality.
Physicality. You walk every day in your garden.
I walk every day up hills.
Oh, yeah.
I cannot bear flat walking. Walking on the flat. I have to really. I use a stick, but I have to walk up hills or I feel I Haven't gone for a walk.
Keep climbing those mountains. That's. You climb every mountain, right. So hills do you do. You know, everybody's really into weights.
I try and do one session a week, but my. My schedule is so full that trying to pinpoint a session for a one on one, which I've tried to. I did it for a year while I was recovering, of course. And then once you start feeling well, I mean physically well, your. My discipline goes out of the window, so.
Well, I think you. I mean, you said you're chaotic, but you're also very disciplined, aren't you?
Well, I'm disciplined in many ways, yes.
Yes, but some you are and some you're not. The ones that you choose that are the most important.
Exactly. Exactly.
What else do you think is really key to this time of life and positive ageing? Jane Fonda talks about coming back to things so you can release them and move on to things. Have you found that for yourself? I think that's more. I mean, everybody's really different and they'll have a different kind of psychological need on that.
I've always. I've been a reader all my life and every book I've loved. I've kept thinking I will come back to it and reread it and reimagine it. But there's so much good literature out there, I never get to it.
Yes.
So I don't think I'm coming back to it, really. I've got so much I want to do. The one. One thing that perhaps I'm not good at doing is having this balance in life. And I keep promising Colin that I'm going to work on it and have more time.
Didn't you do that when you sold the business?
Oh, yes.
And so what's happened? You just replaced it with all the foundation work?
I've done it almost every year because I'm still involved in the business and our farm, the pheasant farm, and our farm, shop and cellar door. That's all the families still. And so I'm very involved in that. I sit on the board, the ASX board of the company. I'm still involved in product development, the foundation. But I get asked to do beautiful things too, and I accept those. And they're often with music, like being invited by the Melbourne Symphony Orchestra to do a concert with them, where I chose the music and sat on stage and Greta Bradman and I talked about why I had chosen the music and being surrounded by the musicians playing this music that's so important to me. I mean, these things happen to me.
These things happen to you because you're a legend and an icon and you bring across, you meld so many things, like music is the food of love, you know, as Shakespeare says, play on. So the fact that you're so. You have these great life forces within you and you explain them so beautifully that people can take part in. What about for people who just don't quite know what those things are that gives them that delight and that passion
and that purpose, then they should be searching because you need to find it. Everyone has got some. Something in them that will open a gate, but you need. If it doesn't come to you easily, you've got to put your mind to investigating it and trying things.
I think a lot of women put off those things over years because they've been raising kids or looking after parents or working so hard in a career. I mean, you've combined your great passions in a career. I have, and so have I, and I've been lucky in that, that I've been able to do that. But sometimes people, you know, haven't been able to do that. But then they can go back, can't they, and think, what is it I didn't want to do? You know, what is it I always wanted to do that I didn't do? You know, like, I've always wanted to have a punk band. So that's my. Okay, that's my next adventure.
Well, I want to sculpt.
Do you?
I want to sculpt, but I want big sculptures.
But for your garden?
Well, yes, probably. I've got this beautiful. Well, we live in very old cottage and big sheds and I've got the perfect place. I just don't have the time yet. But, you know, that's my bucket list of one more thing I would like to take on. I have a choir because singing is. Singing is so good for the heart. It really is. And now if someone is wondering what they want to do in life, no matter what age, go down to one of these pub choirs and just be embraced by people singing and see what it does for you. Even if you don't sing, even if you're just listening.
A lot of people think they can't sing. They've been told they can't sing, but let it out. It doesn't have to be perfect. Especially in a pub choir. They're joy, aren't they?
Absolute joy. And the more community choirs, the more things that bring communities together. Ah, I know what they can do. One of the most important things Is when you do something for someone else. And so I think volunteering should be part of the curriculum for young high school students, for instance, that it's part of the way they grow up. And I particularly love it if they went to aged care homes and listened to the stories or read letters. But everyone knows when you do something for someone else, you feel better. So if you are unsure of what you want to do, go and do something for someone else as your starting point.
I think so. But in the sandwich generation, we're often doing so much for other people. We're not doing enough for ourselves. But I do think that's true. Yeah, we do things full on, and then we kind of stop and then burn out. Burn out and so. And stop. And then there's a coming back to those sort of things. And I think that is the power of aging. A coming back to those passions, a coming back to giving, a coming back to looking after others that we can, if we're not there yet, we can look forward to. And people don't look forward to aging. Cause they approach it with trepidation and fear.
And our society, you know, confounds that. You know, it talks about that. And that really makes me cross because I know I'm in years, I'm 81, but my gosh, it doesn't stop me. And I just don't feel old. Even if I need a stick when I'm going up the hills.
Yeah, I know. I walk past a mirror or something and I'll go, who's that? Because in my head, I'm still 27. We forget our age. And that's a great thing because, yes,
forgetting your age is a wonderful thing. And don't let it limit you.
Absolutely. Well, you don't let it limit you. And you're a force of nature. And I thank you so much for your advice today. I think there's so many kind of lessons in there for us to enjoy.
Can I say one of the things? When you first were in touch with me and talked about the sandwich generation, I thought one of the most important things of someone with a career, themselves, young children and parents to look after that true definition, I guess, of that. Ask everyone to help. I mean, that should be the absolute pinnacle of what you need to do is ask everyone's help. Don't try and take it on as one person. That's my take on it.
It's so true. We often feel we have to take it on. Often siblings. There aren't siblings. Or they're away or they don't step up. And sometimes you can feel so trapped in the vortex, you don't think you've even got time to ask for help. There's a great power in asking for help.
Oh, there is. There is. You need help. They want to. You know, most people want to be needed, too. And I'm talking kids and grandchildren and. Yes. Cousins, Everybody. Community neighbours, everyone ask for help.
Don't be too. Yeah, it's weird how people don't. Sometimes I think they can forget, or they're scared of being told no, or they just don't even have time to even think of it.
Yes.
But ask for it. You'll be surprised what people can do. Thank you. That is.
Yeah, yeah.
Any other world. Are there any other pearls of wisdom?
No, no, I wouldn't call me wise. I just. Busy.
You're so busy. And thank you for taking time out of your incredibly busy schedule. You're never going to retire, are you? Because.
Yeah, there's.
There.
I was at a meeting for the foundation and we were talking succession plans and I said, well, I'm not going to retire. And besides, there's no Japanese. Did you know there's no Japanese word for retirement? And our facilitator, who had lived in Japan, said, ah, yes, but there is. There is a word for dying at your desk.
Is that your aim? You're going to die at your desk one day?
Yes. Yeah. But he also talked to me about the concept of utori Y U T O R I and that is the concept of having enough in your life to fulfill you, but not too much to overwhelm you. To be active and your mind to be engaged, your heart to be engaged. I'm paraphrasing, but that's my aim. Balance.
Yeah, that's perfect. That's beautiful. I think you're veering more towards the work side, but you might have such joy and fun in your work. So you're probably the definition of that. Gee, we're getting deep. Maggie B.
Thank you so much. Oh, Sarah, it's been lovely. Really lovely.
Please send this podcast episode to someone you know who is thinking about their own ageing or is looking at aged care and is thinking about the food. Ask them if the cook has done Maggie Beer's course or if they will do it, please, and be part of those modules. You can also email us@helloubsandwich.community and you can suggest ideas that we might want to pursue in the podcast, things you would like to see covered. Anything like that. Follow us on social media and remember, you are doing a great job. And while you have got them, we have got you. Today's episode was supported by Australian Unity Home Health and Care Proactive local care that helps your parents stay independent and living well at home. Visit australianunity.com auclubsandwich.
You make one phone call to get help for your aging mum or dad and suddenly you are drowning in acronyms and waiting lists. The aged care system, it's a bit of a wall of these acronyms, phone calls, waiting lists, and nobody's really giving you a map or a guide. Well, we see you. We want you to know that you're not behind, you haven't left it too late, and wherever you're starting from is the right place to start. You don't have to hold all of this in your head on your own. And you can keep what matters most to your ageing mum or dad right at the centre of every decision. That's what Vera is here for, any time of the day or night at Vera Guide. It's free, safe and secure, built right here in Australia with families and the experts who know this journey.